Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Well, thank you for coming on. Peter Gutos friend, longtime Saratogian.
Saratogian supporter. Through my decades of work there and to the community itself.
And July 4th is not even around the corner. It's like the shadows creeping in now.
And this is the 19th Firecracker 4 for you.
[00:00:35] Speaker B: It is, Stan. And thank you for coming in and doing this.
I don't believe I've gone to an event that I haven't seen you at. And I really appreciate you following us and everybody else in the entire expanded region. So thank you. Yes, it's our 19th.
Hard to believe we looked very little great for 19.
Well, right now I'm a little weary, but it'll all be better on the 5th of July.
[00:01:08] Speaker A: How did this.
Before we go into everything, Firecracker 4 just. I know you as a racing dad, right? You know the lineage of tremendous road racers, cross country track athletes, throughout Saratoga Springs history.
And that's how we first knew each other. And then this race evolved.
But that's about it, because when I think of Peter, I'm like, okay, the kids. And then I think of the race. But what's your Saratoga history? And how did you come to land in the spa city and become so entrenched in this community?
[00:01:54] Speaker B: I was a runner in high school. I continued that early in college, went into cross country skiing, had with my wife Cheryl, four wonderful kids, two of which decided to take up running after hockey.
We trained and ran in Saratoga Springs, as all parents do. We got involved with the Booster Club, created one and became very good as parents in washing cars and selling wreaths and doing all kinds of things that we do for our kids, that we think our kids are going to do.
So the kids did help a lot, by the way. But one day at one of our Booster Club meetings, one of our members said, why don't we do something different? Why don't we have a road race? So we looked around and said, well, why don't we do a holiday road race? Why don't we do it on the 4th of July?
And we did some preliminary calls, got approval, had about 150 people run it the first year.
Decided we wanted to be very community oriented and run the streets.
So we picked Broadway to start and finish, and that's how it started.
[00:03:15] Speaker A: 150.
[00:03:16] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:17] Speaker A: You're like, the first one's the toughest one. Is anybody gonna show?
[00:03:23] Speaker B: Right.
[00:03:24] Speaker A: Are we gonna not lose our shirts? Literally, we.
[00:03:27] Speaker B: Yeah, it was a.
It was a fun start. It was probably not the most engineered race.
Probably didn't make a lot of folks happy because we didn't do the level of outreach that we did. But then again, we only had 150 people running a four mile run around.
We were there and gone in a heartbeat.
But we learned a lot the first year, and it was good.
[00:03:59] Speaker A: And July 4th, great day.
[00:04:03] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:04:04] Speaker A: And this.
So July 4th is a. Is an easy calendar date. It's set in stone. It's got so much familiarity to it, to everyone, probably across the world.
Where did the four mile come in? Because that makes it so unique.
Was that right off the rip that we wanted to be different?
[00:04:27] Speaker B: We wanted to be different. 4 mile, 4th of July, non traditional mileage, very short distance in the world of distance runners.
Remembering that a large part of our history here in Saratoga is cross country running, not just track and field.
So we were trying to bridge that uniqueness of not being a 5k but not getting into a half marathon, which is also fairly populated in terms of number of races. And takes a tremendous amount of energy to pull off a four mile race actually just fit completely well in the cycle of races in our area.
[00:05:17] Speaker A: Who gets the credit?
Who gets the blame for the course creation? Because it looks great at the start. It's a little downhill glide, and everybody's smiling.
And then we have Saratoga's version of Heartbreak Hill with the finish. It's so unique. And it's a test.
And, you know, not necessarily first to 32nd, but I'm sure, you know, 15th to 50th and 100 to 200 occurs.
[00:05:53] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:05:53] Speaker A: As you're coming up towards the city center on that backside. So who masterminded that? Was it just the mileage dictated that, or is there a little.
Ah, let's make it memorable.
[00:06:07] Speaker B: Well, my race partner through all these years, Bob Vandermitten, is really good at laying things out. So once we went around and said 4 miles, what streets, how could we do it?
He technically got into the mapping software and then went out and physically looked at everything. And we then had this course certified as a four mile course. So we basically made a lot of different variations of how it could work, emphasizing that we only wanted to cross a minimum amount of very busy streets and get off Broadway very quickly, which is why we start on Broadway and end behind Broadway right where Ellsworth Jones Way is, so that we are off Broadway. We only closed that down for a limited amount of time, 30 to 45 minutes.
But yeah, Bob did all that. He was great. He's got maps and he calculated it out. And we did our Tangents and it worked out very well.
[00:07:24] Speaker A: It's incredible. 150 now we're in the thousands, thousands, thousands of people on bro. It's like a movie. Belmont on Broadway, concert of runners. Because I know in, in pa I've done. There's been years where I'll videotape the start and my. I'm holding the camera up overheads and I'm like two and a half, three minutes. I'm like, my arm is dying. People are still coming in.
Did you ever imagine?
[00:07:56] Speaker B: No. It surprises us every year. Bob and I and Charlie Woodruff will look after everybody goes by us and say, oh my gosh, you know, there are so many people here. We're so happy. Now we just have to get them all back.
But no, I didn't expect it to be this popular.
We have a great venue.
It's never hard to get people to come to Saratoga Springs and we provide us a very unique opportunity. It's a real nice start of the holiday.
Remembering that a lot of people come back to visit friends and family here.
And it is a community and a all age event.
So literally you've got folks running throughout the decades of years, but you've got moms and dads with strollers with one and two kids. We've got, you know, we have no barriers to entry on this at all. And we even added the kids race, which has blossomed into an over 300 person children's race for 0.2 miles.
[00:09:09] Speaker A: The end.
Again, it's evolved. Everything's with the success you see with a race like this, an event like this, and with. With organizers who have vision and support, everything evolves. Because you start out year one 150 and now we're here at 19 and probably 2,000 plus.
[00:09:33] Speaker B: I would anticipate 2,500 this year.
[00:09:38] Speaker A: But along the way, and again, I don't know if Bob gets credit or blame for this, but it became festival.
[00:09:45] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:09:46] Speaker A: Music and bands and runners, if they haven't been on the course, are exposed to again, the Boston Marathon, where people are in their yards, they're cheering, they have signs, they have their own water stations on some of the most memorable July force, which I don't think it's ever rained on a July 4th for your race because it always seems to be pretty crisp.
They're hosen.
[00:10:13] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:10:13] Speaker A: And so it became a race and it, I think then fun quickly came in and then the festival side of music and you know, this week, you know, Garland Nelson with Soul Session. Right. At Ellsworth Park. Great Friend of the podcast, Just a wonderful human being. I can't wait to listen to him as much as I can.
[00:10:31] Speaker B: Hey, yeah.
[00:10:33] Speaker A: When did that expand to that type of event?
[00:10:39] Speaker B: One year my wife and I, Cheryl went to Utica and ran the Boilermaker. The kids were running. We said we would do it.
It's a 10k iconic, world widely known event and they have bands on the course and entertainment and all kinds of things. If you imagine Utica and running some of those hills there, you need all the encouragement you can get.
So we thought about Saratoga and said, well, we, we want to go out and we want to embrace the community.
We're using people's streets. I mean, that's not lost on us. We're asking permission to use them. So we went out into the neighborhoods as we do every year with our high school running kids, and we knock on every door and we invite everybody to come to the race. We do that at least once, sometimes twice.
And our little script that's on paper and narrative is thank you for using the street.
We will not be here for long.
Safety is very important.
Please watch out, backing up. And if you'd like to come out, bring a hose, bring a cowbell, bring your friends, have coffee, do whatever you'd like. And if you would like to have a band on your porch or on your front Lawn, we've got 20 to 25 of them and we're looking for places.
And folks started to call and say, yes, we'd like that.
Funny that some people just bring their own band. So we never know what's going to happen on the street today. This morning, in fact, I got a email from John on Springwood saying, just wanted to let you know we're setting up a water station on the corner of Springwood.
We'll be out here again, which they are all year long. And we're just so happy that folks do that.
[00:12:51] Speaker A: As appreciative as you are of that, is there a little bit of a not surprise because the community you've known for so long is kind of like that Saratoga.
[00:13:03] Speaker B: I have never been let down living in Saratoga. We do a lot of amazing things for not only our athletes, but for our residents and our guests. We have the known items, like having the track three times this year, which is incredible. And for the first time on the 4th of July, the meet. And I'm so happy we have that attention.
We have the museums, the automobile museum, the racing museum, the military museum. A lot of opportunities for people to do things on that side. We've Got the downtown. Our businesses are always open and happy to have people in. Then we've got all our athletics, whether it's the rowing regattas or the races like us and the turkey trot and others.
Plus, I mean, consider our baseball teams this year.
I mean, we really have a lot going for us and people want to be here and we like to have people here in Saratoga. We're a very welcoming community, so it's a lot of fun.
[00:14:20] Speaker A: And this evolved, this was created out of a meeting of the minds as a booster club to raise funds for our kids, our programs and the future of that program.
And then as the race expanded, exploded.
You just continue giving back and more and more and more and more. And what, what's been kind of the lineage of those funds? I mean, I don't know if you have an exact number, but you know, how many, I mean, how many different organizations have we impacted through the years? And what does the other part of this race mean?
[00:15:01] Speaker B: Yeah, we've calculated we've likely given about 400,000 back to the community.
This started by supporting our cross country track and field programs.
And they are still recipients of money and they work very hard too. They're with us for this race and they help prepare us. The parents are there for us, the kids do a lot of the work.
We've been able to use the funds to support health and recreation in Saratoga. So we've likely given to about 20 to 22 different entities which have included the broad aspects of athletics, trail building, trail planning and development.
We've funded early on the Saratoga Greenbelt Trail system. And my wife and I sat on that committee with a number of other people who actually organized that. And we saw that we could put a framework together for a 9 mile inner loop and a 9 mile outer loop which has been over the years being constructed in pieces by the city and others.
We've helped fund some of that.
We designed and developed the Pitney Meadow Community Garden trail system, the 1.7 mile, which was a number of us. I don't take the credit for that, but we had resources to put into that.
We've helped out with connecting trails.
This year, part of the proceeds are going to Saratoga, AIM and Wilton to do a recreational walkabout trail, water level, ADA compatible and hopefully will link to some of the existing trail plans. In Wilton.
We funded the adaptive Bikes for Camp abilities.
We've been very fortunate to have just about every organization in Saratoga come out and help us with the race. And we are very happy to have that organization doing Camp abilities up in Skidmore campus.
And then there's little pocket things that we do too when we see a need.
[00:17:25] Speaker A: How many takes a village to raise a child? It takes a army to put together a race for a regatta and these big events. How many volunteers do you think that are out there along pre during post because set up, take down, it disappears.
It disappears. It's literally in the kindest way. It's the guy with the shovel behind the L. I mean, it disappears as they finish.
[00:17:56] Speaker B: Yeah, we have people the minute that that last runner is down Broadway. We've got the boys going out with the coaches picking up the course.
How many people does it take? If I hazarded a guess, I'd say 100 people just to cover the course and probably 130 if you had in our organizers, our bands, our band coordinator.
We are very fortunate to get that level of attention.
We literally put one or two people on every intersection and that is to support the Saratoga Springs Police Department, who really, quite honestly don't need us. But they are on the major intersections and we have everybody organized under an operational plan that is put together by the city police department.
A lot of folks don't realize that it's not just showing up, it's actually executing a plan.
And we do a post mortem afterwards to see how we did and we will be told how we did and. And then we can improve for the next year.
Knock on Wood has been going okay. We've been doing pretty good.
[00:19:21] Speaker A: With this race.
19.
You're still doing it?
[00:19:28] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:19:32] Speaker A: Are you going to. Do you hope to get promoted? What we've talked about before was race director emeritus or is this just going to be.
[00:19:43] Speaker B: Well, we would like to see the race continue. I think it brings a lot to the 4th of July and we are networked and do this in coordination with the Chamber of Commerce with Discover Saratoga and the City Center. So it is part of the All American celebration. It's our kickoff.
Am I going to retire? I would love to.
I think we have a good transition team in the making.
I think I'll be around to help out.
But the stage is set and we're going to come up on our 20th next year, which is a pretty big deal. And myself and Bob and Charlie Woodruff and others have all said, well, why don't we start to find folks who are maybe of the ages that we were when we started this whole thing and have them carry. Carry it on.
[00:20:41] Speaker A: So what have you learned from that first small race to now, you know what, what have you learned what are those things you're going to impart on that, that transition team for the next 20 that you learned early on and to get to this level?
[00:21:05] Speaker B: Well, for putting on a race like this, I've learned a lot by going to other events, whether it be a race or as in the case of musical or entertainment productions, to see how things are executed. I think the biggest lesson I've learned is don't not do something. When you think of it, time goes by very quickly.
As an example, right now we're in our last couple of days and I'm going through a checklist and realizing a couple of things that needed to get done and we're out chasing them down and getting them done.
And the other thing is we.
It's as much as you can ask folks early to help, the volunteers are there for us. And it's gotten luckily to a point. And don't get me wrong, we still need volunteers. People can still sign up on our website, but people will just come out and go to their assigned place.
And many times I don't even have them on the list anymore. They just show up with their vest and their flag, which is wonderful that however, we try to get everybody organized so we've got everybody on the list so we know the intersections are covered.
And I guess the other thing I've learned too is the generosity of Saratoga Springs.
The people who support this race, who donate to it, who come and help, who provide food. We've had countless local entities help us with refreshments.
Hannaford has helped us. Price Chopper has helped us. Thorn and Roots here does our our bananas and comes out every year and helps. We've got local businesses that just pitch in, help us promote. We've got 10 different restaurants that we feature to for folks to go out afterwards because we don't have a party at the end except for the kids. We have ice cream and stuff for them. But after our race gets done, we basically release the 2000 plus people to what they would like to do. And all the restaurants that we can get to be open by then, some actually sign up and give us specials.
So we can. And we announced that and put that on the website.
When you think about it, if you have 2,500 runners, it's not 2,500 people.
It can be choice, set or even greater because people bring people.
So it's a nice little pop for what could be a kind of quiet morning in Saratoga on the 4th.
[00:24:00] Speaker A: We had the, you know, we had the big announcement, not surprising Announcement that Belmont would be back for a third year.
We don't know about the fourth for next year. We know it's here this year. Yeah, we haven't even broached that subject yet because let's get through this week and then get through the kickoff of the regular Saratoga me. What could it be like to have the July 4th festival, racing festival back on the 4th next year for the Firecrackers?
The Firecracker 4 mile race is 20th.
Is that.
Is that the way to go out? Is that the. Is it. Is. Is that the home run and go around the bases and just hang up the hat? Is that kind of like this is it? We're really out? We're really out. If we hit this, you know, magic number. Magic number. It's like, okay, we're definitely transitioning out. What would it mean to get that type of excitement for a 20 and a final return?
[00:25:02] Speaker B: Any. Any event that is happening when this is happening and for all of the Saratoga celebration events for the Fourth of July weekend is a net positive. We bring people in for the race, but Naira's bringing people in for the first time for horse racing, and SPAP brings people in for concerts and we get some of those people.
So we provide one more thing to do. And it happens to sit at a time in the day where it could be open for people prior to going to the track, prior to going to spac. But no, I see Naira's participation in bringing horse racing on the fourth to be a net positive for the community. It certainly isn't going to hurt us. I think we're going to get positiveness out of it.
I would like to say next year would be great if they came back, too.
I would think that you will be doing this interview with somebody at the 25th anniversary of the Firecracker. So we're going to see if we have horse racing then, but no, I think it'll go on, but I think it's a net positive.
[00:26:20] Speaker A: There's so many memories and there's so many hits and misses over a career. And this is beyond a career I don't think you signed up for 20 years ago was a good idea.
And being you and knowing you, it's like no surprise you're in the center of it.
But are there one or two that just you will, you know, 20 years from now talk about again about this race or.
You know, what was great was this.
[00:26:53] Speaker B: We've had a lot of firsts in the race.
We had Ainsley's Angels come very early with Sean and Seamus and be part of this. And they have gone all over the world now, those two. I actually went to watch my son Dimitri at the Boston Marathon and Sean and Seamus come by and we got to wave at the halfway point. Don't think they saw us, but they were pretty focused.
We have had the chamber has a veterans group and they've run in cadence with us for years and that was very memorable. That kind of stops you when you see that.
Just wonderful.
I think the most remarkable part of the race, which many of us on the organization team agree is watching the kids and having that little point two from o' Brien end to the, to the official finish and have the flags, the two flags. Typically we have always Saratoga Springs ladder truck and then sometimes we have Maple Avenue and sometimes we have Boston Spa and you see this gaggle of kids running down.
Little kids don't run straight lines, so it's probably a 0.25 or 0.3 for some of them. And you see the parents running with them and they're just all happy and it's a big deal. They're running in the street, number one. And there's ice cream at the end, so it doesn't hurt. But yeah, those are some of the memories that I'll carry on with.
[00:28:35] Speaker A: What's July 5th like for you?
[00:28:39] Speaker B: Well, mixed message on that. It's. We're pretty tired.
It's also my wife and I's anniversary.
[00:28:49] Speaker A: Oh, fantastic.
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Yeah, well, she'll not agree with you because I've slept through most of them.
But no, it's. It's really nice.
It's nice to unpack.
There was a time where we had so many different parts of this that we all did ourselves that it would take days to unravel everything.
We've actually compartmentalized more now and it goes. And we've asked for help and have people so it goes a lot easier now. But yeah, July 5th is an exhale and then we.
Then we just look forward to July 12th in the Silks and satins which we are planning at the same time as the fourth of July event.
So we just roll into that. That's a nice 700 person, 800 person race.
[00:29:43] Speaker A: Right across from the track.
[00:29:45] Speaker B: Right across from the track. With our great partners at Fassa, Tipton and Naira this year providing us with passes for the track as a incentive in the racing museum.
Providing for both races. Passes to the racing museum.
So it's. Yeah, it's. It's nice. We get to July 12, July 13, and then from there we're just looking towards the revolutionary run in Schuylerville in November.
The.
[00:30:16] Speaker A: We have a little bit of time.
We have a little bit of. We have a.
We have a short date, but it's still a big window to help and to be a part of this.
Right. So where do people go to sign up to help and show up to find out, confirm where they're assigned to go to their spots. And then also, you know, weather's on your side. This might be my favorite. This might be my favorite.
We're looking runner, spectator, happy weather.
[00:30:50] Speaker B: We've got a pretty nice forecast. We've had those hot, hot, hot days. We've set up ancillary water stations before. We're always prepared for that.
So where do people go?
If you went to fc4events.com fcfore events.com gets you to our registration page and our volunteer page. You can select what you would like to do.
If you are a volunteer, we'd like you to report to the city center not later than quarter of eight on race day.
And we will have a briefing for our new volunteers. The police will help us with that. And then we disperse out with flags and vests.
Anyone who would like to help with registration, we do need help for the night before at the city center from 11:00am to 5:30pm and then day of registration from the 7:00 clock to 9:00 o' clock. And different than most races, we never close registration.
We have had people run out of the registration room and run to the back of the pack because it started already.
But we won't in heat. We will make sure people get in this race so you can register all the way up to Ecuador 9.
[00:32:13] Speaker A: And part of that is also the accurate timing. You know, our friends at Albany running exchange, you know, Josh is so great and as a journalist and a sports writer for decades, when I see the are van, I'm like going, I'm going to have results in about 15 seconds.
[00:32:30] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:32:30] Speaker A: So grateful for just the work that they do. But just it just adds because it's, it's accurate timing. It's an immediate timing and they, and they are partner. They really are.
They're runners. They're, you know, same DNA and it's one of those partners that get it and everything they do help you make this such a great event.
[00:32:53] Speaker B: Yeah, they've been Josh and his team, John. Others have been with us the entire time and they've grown and we've grown.
Some in this area might not know that are goes nationwide now they have a wonderful headquarters in Albany that they've built.
And we used to think that we were the big deal race for them, and we're not. They can do anything. So we're very happy to have them as a partner. You know, they used to come and run in costume because it was a race day off for some of them.
[00:33:27] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:33:27] Speaker B: Yeah. Amazing.
[00:33:29] Speaker A: Josh has run before. I've seen him before. I think he's doing some biking now. A little bit more biking.
[00:33:33] Speaker B: He's really good, too. I mean, he's Glenn Death.
[00:33:36] Speaker A: There are some top athletes. I think if. I think if they had the time, I think they could be. I think they could be breaking the tape.
[00:33:44] Speaker B: Well, we need them on our side of the tape with a.
[00:33:49] Speaker A: So we'll encourage them to have fun at the Boilermaker. But we need you here for our three.
[00:33:53] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:33:54] Speaker A: Our big three.
Ari, you ready for the tough question?
[00:33:57] Speaker B: Sure.
[00:33:58] Speaker A: Okay. There's only one, because you know me, I'm an easygoing guy.
What's next for you?
What's next for Peter Mutos?
[00:34:10] Speaker B: We have had an opportunity in the last year to have a granddaughter and we're about to have another granddaughter in August.
So ARV and emphasis has shifted a little bit.
This is a new world for us and for our family. Both girls are going to have little girls or one. In fact, Viviana is already here and Cornelia is on her way. So that's where we're putting a lot of emphasis and energy.
[00:34:45] Speaker A: So we will see you early.
We'll see a Thursday at registration. We'll see a Friday day of, we'll see two people for sure break the tape and then I'll probably have to run up.
You know, it's a union.
[00:35:02] Speaker B: We have a very competitive race lining up, which I think could be a course setting opportunity because the runners in the weather are aligning.
But this is not just about running and breaking the tape first. This is, as we all say, you know, running. Charlie Woodruff will tell you running changes everything. And I always say running is a like sport.
Coming out and participating with all these people is an encouragement to get through four miles. And it is a run walk.
Now, we do ask people, since we have music on the course, to not forget to run walk. Don't hang out for two hours in front of your favorite band or we have to come and collect you. But yes, it's a nice hour stall if you think about it. And it's entertaining and it's fun. So good, good way to come see the city.
[00:36:01] Speaker A: Absolutely. Well, this is something that I had in, in my mind when I came up with the idea of this podcast. And I tell people all the time through my career. I meet so many interesting people. I have so many great stories to tell.
And the goal is to introduce people in print with a Daily Gazette and that print version of this and then also the podcast, which we hope all lives on forever, both print and podcast, to people that are wonderful people first that I enjoy being around and then are making an impact.
And so you are, you're up there on my Mount Rushmore. You're on night four of people that I'm like, I'm doing this and I'm going to time this out to get Peter on here to talk about this race, because everything you've done for the racing community and for the city of Saratoga Springs and for runners and, you know, I've enjoyed all our time together and the family and Dimitri and Cassidy running and just seeing those names and those photos and laughing and it's, it's been a joy.
And it may sunset a little, hopefully for you in the next couple years, but I'll see you at the start.
[00:37:21] Speaker B: You're very kind. This whole thing happens because of all the people who contribute to it.
So I'm honored to be there with my partners organizing, but it's the 120 people and the supporters who make it happen. So I'm very thankful to have the opportunity to be part of it.
[00:37:42] Speaker A: Thank you so much.
[00:37:43] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:37:47] Speaker A: It's.
[00:37:48] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:37:51] Speaker A: It's me. That's why I tell people if they're not familiar with me when I pitch.
[00:37:55] Speaker B: This, you can't make people.
